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does the amount matter?
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bbillcee



Joined: 23 Oct 2009
Posts: 30

PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2009 6:17 pm    Post subject: does the amount matter? Reply with quote

i am having a bit of trouble understanding something,

does the amount of gluten have any revelance?

if i eat 10 bowls of regular pasta or eat a burger that was taken off a bun....is it the same thing or is eating more worse?


if i haven't eaten gluten in 10 years and eat a burger on a bun is my whole world gonna collapse?
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aklap



Joined: 02 Oct 2004
Posts: 10612
Location: WI, USA

PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2009 6:48 pm    Post subject: Re: does the amount matter? Reply with quote

bbillcee wrote:
does the amount of gluten have any revelance?

if i eat 10 bowls of regular pasta or eat a burger that was taken off a bun....is it the same thing or is eating more worse?

For someone that reacts to gluten - any amount is too much. We're talking parts per million quantities. In a perfect world gluten-free would equal 0 ppm of gluten. Our world is not perfect and it would be extremely difficult to reach 0 ppms. If we could, there's be no way of knowing if we did because current testing can only go done to 3 ppm.

What's parts per million? Think of 999,997 green tennis balls - now put 3 orange tennis balls in the mix. Yeah, it's not that much.

http://www.diet.com/dietblogs/read_blog.php?title=Gluten%3A+Is+It+OK+To+Have+A+Little+Bit%3F&blid=13481

bbillcee wrote:
if i haven't eaten gluten in 10 years and eat a burger on a bun is my whole world gonna collapse?

Over the long haul if you continue to expose yourself to gluten, the effects will add up - increasing your risk of certain cancers and other cascading auto-immune disease.

Short term - depending on how you react - you may never feel it, or you may feel it for days/weeks/months.
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“We cannot all do great things, but we can do small things with great love.” Mother Teresa


Last edited by aklap on Mon Oct 26, 2009 7:34 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Deb



Joined: 23 Oct 2004
Posts: 394
Location: Long Island, New York

PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2009 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can only tell you my experiences. I have been gluten free for over 9 years. 2 yrs ago, I had a bladder infection in January...the doctor had me get an OTC med called Azo Standard. Most everything I read about it said it was gluten free, some people were not sure, and I could not get a hold of the company. I had one dose at supper, 1 at breakfast, and 1 at lunch. The next morning I was hit with a terrible neurologic attack because it did contain gluten, probably in the filler. I was sick for 4 months, and lost 24#. How much gluten do you think I may have gotten out of 3 doses of a med that was thought to be gluten free?

At my support groups Gluten Free Vendor Fair, I ate maybe 2 cookies, and a tiny piece of cake, took me 3 weeks to get over it.

So, yes, for me, it does make my whole world collapse for some time. I am a super sensitive, it may not be that bad for you, or it just might be. Do you really want to take that chance???
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bbillcee



Joined: 23 Oct 2009
Posts: 30

PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2009 6:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Deb wrote:
I can only tell you my experiences. I have been gluten free for over 9 years. 2 yrs ago, I had a bladder infection in January...the doctor had me get an OTC med called Azo Standard. Most everything I read about it said it was gluten free, some people were not sure, and I could not get a hold of the company. I had one dose at supper, 1 at breakfast, and 1 at lunch. The next morning I was hit with a terrible neurologic attack because it did contain gluten, probably in the filler. I was sick for 4 months, and lost 24#. How much gluten do you think I may have gotten out of 3 doses of a med that was thought to be gluten free?

At my support groups Gluten Free Vendor Fair, I ate maybe 2 cookies, and a tiny piece of cake, took me 3 weeks to get over it.

So, yes, for me, it does make my whole world collapse for some time. I am a super sensitive, it may not be that bad for you, or it just might be. Do you really want to take that chance???


i assume u were having terrible symptoms before u went gf?
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Deb



Joined: 23 Oct 2004
Posts: 394
Location: Long Island, New York

PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2009 8:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You assume correctly. I was very ill.

Quote:
What's parts per million? Think of 999,997 green tennis balls - now put 3 orange tennis balls in the mix. Yeah, it's not that much.


That's great Al, thank you.
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aklap



Joined: 02 Oct 2004
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Location: WI, USA

PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2009 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh, just to add...the good news is that many experts feel that 20 parts per million is a safe limit. Some people feel they react to even lesser amounts.
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Al

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STZ



Joined: 21 Apr 2009
Posts: 136
Location: Corpus Christi, TX

PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2009 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am the same as Deb any amount makes me very ill. If I was you I would just stay away from it.
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aklap



Joined: 02 Oct 2004
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Location: WI, USA

PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2009 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Deb wrote:
At my support groups Gluten Free Vendor Fair, I ate maybe 2 cookies, and a tiny piece of cake, took me 3 weeks to get over it.

So...there was NGF cookies & cake at the Expo?
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Deb



Joined: 23 Oct 2004
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Location: Long Island, New York

PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 6:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
So...there was NGF cookies & cake at the Expo?


Everything was gluten free. I would never put anything in my mouth knowing it contained gluten. Surprised

Thing is, like you mentioned, 20ppm may be ok for some, but there are some of us who just can't tolerate that amount. Some of us, me being one, can't tolerate the products that state they contain less than 5ppm. I now stay away from all grains, simply because of the gluten CC issues. They say Lunberg rice is totally safe, seems they grow it, and harvest it with equipment used only for the rice.

By the way, our Gluten Free Vendor Fairs are so popular now, this next April, we are having it for 2 days.

Bbillcee--I was thinking about this:
Quote:

i assume u were having terrible symptoms before u went gf?


Yes, I did have terrible symptoms before going gluten free, but that doesn't mean I was any worse off than anyone else. Those whom never have symptoms are in just as much danger from gluten as I was/am. My body is just better at telling me that gluten is poison, my body is very aware of what's going on inside. I'm guessing that makes me much better off than some, even though it's very difficult being this sensitive. A double edged sword there huh?
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bbillcee



Joined: 23 Oct 2009
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Deb wrote:
Quote:
So...there was NGF cookies & cake at the Expo?


Everything was gluten free. I would never put anything in my mouth knowing it contained gluten. Surprised

Thing is, like you mentioned, 20ppm may be ok for some, but there are some of us who just can't tolerate that amount. Some of us, me being one, can't tolerate the products that state they contain less than 5ppm. I now stay away from all grains, simply because of the gluten CC issues. They say Lunberg rice is totally safe, seems they grow it, and harvest it with equipment used only for the rice.

By the way, our Gluten Free Vendor Fairs are so popular now, this next April, we are having it for 2 days.

Bbillcee--I was thinking about this:
Quote:

i assume u were having terrible symptoms before u went gf?


Yes, I did have terrible symptoms before going gluten free, but that doesn't mean I was any worse off than anyone else. Those whom never have symptoms are in just as much danger from gluten as I was/am. My body is just better at telling me that gluten is poison, my body is very aware of what's going on inside. I'm guessing that makes me much better off than some, even though it's very difficult being this sensitive. A double edged sword there huh?


ok so someone who had very mild symptoms can also get very ill like this after ingesting gluten after a long time?

i read so much about people bringing back gluten into the diet after 3-6 months yet alot of people on this site treat gluten like sulphuric acid...please do not take me the wrong way, what might be right for some may not be the case for all is my point
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aklap



Joined: 02 Oct 2004
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Location: WI, USA

PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 8:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
i read so much about people bringing back gluten into the diet after 3-6 months

Can you tell us why these people were re-introducing gluten? Perhaps they were doing a gluten challenge in hopes of getting a proper diagnosis? Perhaps they are uneducated on the effects of consuming gluten. Of course - all this presumes gluten is affecting them negatively.

Quote:
yet alot of people on this site treat gluten like sulphuric acid...please do not take me the wrong way, what might be right for some may not be the case for all is my point

You're right! Smile That's because gluten is a poison. Some researchers/medical professionals feel it's a poison to every human being [not just those that have issues] - we as a species weren't designed and have not evolve yet enough to eat gluten. We started out life as hunter/gatherers. In time we turned to agriculture and starting consuming other food sources. We don't have multiple stomachs like some animals do.

http://www.celiacdisease.net/assets/pdf/SU07CeliacCtr.News.pdf

This is why getting a proper diagnosis is so helpful. If you truly are a celiac, you know straight out gluten is to be removed forever. If you have Non Celiac Gluten Sensitivity, research/studies are showing that gluten is harmful and should be removed completely as well.

This is a hard concept for those trying to figure out what's going on.

For those that need to be on a GF diet - there's not much wiggle room. It's not like a diabetic diet where you can balance out your carbs/sugars for the day.

Keep reading - keep learning!!
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cultureslayer



Joined: 07 Apr 2006
Posts: 921
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 9:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bbillcee wrote:

ok so someone who had very mild symptoms can also get very ill like this after ingesting gluten after a long time?

i read so much about people bringing back gluten into the diet after 3-6 months yet alot of people on this site treat gluten like sulphuric acid...please do not take me the wrong way, what might be right for some may not be the case for all is my point

I had very mild initial symptoms initially. Bloating and fatigue. After several years of gluten free I was glutened last night. I have been completely miserable ever since. I've not had to take any acid reducers since I was gluten free until last night. I'll take the max dose of zantac for at least a week now, and still feel like I'm about to die from the other symptoms.
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jeant



Joined: 06 Apr 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think how one felt before going GF is necessarily related to what they feel like when they are glutened. I know a woman who thought she was dying when the doctors finally figured out she had celiac, yet she's accidentally eaten a little gluten and been okay. I know others who had mild symptoms before but now get sick from the tiniest cross-contamination.

aklap wrote:
Some researchers/medical professionals feel it's a poison to every human being [not just those that have issues] - we as a species weren't designed and have not evolve yet enough to eat gluten.


Another thing to keep in mind is that gluten is not natural. The wheat that grew naturally thousands of years ago had very little gluten in it. But humans liked the chewy texture of gluten, and kept cross-breeding wheat until they ended up with the stuff we have now. So it's no surprise to me that a lot of people cannot tolerate it.
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teacherpat



Joined: 02 Aug 2009
Posts: 165

PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You may have very mild symptoms and, still be having all sorts of horrid stuff going on in there. My aunt had very mild symptoms, that's why she continued eating gluten (and drinking beer, but that is another story-I sometimes think if they'd had Redbridge back then she'd be alive today) and died of cancer because of the resulting autoimmune response. Symptoms are a poor indicator of the severity of the disease process. One of my cousins did not get diagnosed with celiac till she broke a hip-at 35. Intestinal symptoms were minimal, but her osteoporosis is terrible.

bbillcee wrote:
[
ok so someone who had very mild symptoms can also get very ill like this after ingesting gluten after a long time?

i read so much about people bringing back gluten into the diet after 3-6 months yet alot of people on this site treat gluten like sulphuric acid...please do not take me the wrong way, what might be right for some may not be the case for all is my point

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aklap



Joined: 02 Oct 2004
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Location: WI, USA

PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 5:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As others have said, basing your health on symptoms when it comes to gluten ingestion is not a good idea.

You may not react outwardly,but because gluten is a poison,it's still doing damage.

I have a friend that I've known for 27 years. He was properly diagnosed with celiac disease. In his case, he's known as a Silent Celiac. This means he has no outward symptoms when he ingests gluten. He feels no ill-effects. There in lies the problem. Since there's no 'feedback", you don't know if you've been GF or not. Sadly in my friends case, he decided to go back on gluten simply because he couldn't tell the difference. This is a very dangerous decision. I made sure he was aware of what his choices might do in the future.

My firned also thyroid issues for 20 years, a brain tumor, and probably a few other medical issues I've forgotten about .Thyroid conditions are known to be connected with CD. A brother, a sister and mother have been at one time dx'ed with CD.

For those that have mild symptoms pre-GF - often times they become more sensitive after they've been GF- just like others have mentioned.
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“We cannot all do great things, but we can do small things with great love.” Mother Teresa
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